Friday, July 27, 2007

WHAT IS WRONG WITH TODAY'S NEWS REPORTING




ELSINORE MAGAZINE 1
Many have noticed that journalist who report on public agencies is not doing much to report to the public helpful unbias local information that would keep the public well informed on the agencies that serve them.
The Elsinore Valley Municipal Water District EVMWD and Nevada Hydro has been involved in a powerline proposal since 1997 called LEAPS. No license of any kind has been issued nor have any ground breaking ceremony done after 10 years, to the tune of over 3 million dollars of public funds spent. This proposal shows no progress in moving forward. The SEQUA Environmental Impact Report is being stalled, in the making more than a year. This is very unusaul for a project proposal. EM1 would think that the newspapers journalist would be racing to use the The Public Records Act and doing an inhouse review on all of the documents pertaining the 10 year old LEAPS Proposal including the finances. That should be big news,
The Press Enterprise is known for its bias onesided news reporting. On the other hand The Californian News in the past was viewed as the fair practicing unbias news reporting until recently that has not held true in EM1 's opinion. Both papers report on Lake Elsinore news. Take EVMWD,it is easily noticed that EVMWD is hidding something concerning the LEAPS Proposal, yet the journalist tend to take at face value EVMWD's Press Releases without going to the public on what their opinion would be on the LEAPS. EM1 urge the newspapers to take clear notice on the time line of the LEAPS and compare to the 3 millions dollars already spent to no avail. It just make no dollars an cents on what and how the public funds are being spent on a proposal. EM1 feels that the newspapers should take better interest in getting important information to the public especially on the spending of public funds.
Director Phil WILLIAMS continues the attempt to sell to the public that the LEAPS will be built even after 2 strong rejections reports by important agencies who would have strong meaning for or, aganist the LEAPS. As it stands the 2 agencies CAISO and The California Oversight Committee does not favor the LEAPS Proposal.
EM1 urge the public to be selective in chosing their newspapers for a good source of hepful information. The Valley News out of Fallbrook/Escondido has demonstrated that it does its home work in bring informational news to the locals of Lake Elsinore. This paper come out once a week and can be picked up at the Wal Mart each Friday, Lake Elsinore.

50 comments:

Anonymous said...

Sooner or later a smart intuative reporter that goes after facts will expose EVMWD. A big story would be why has EVMWD spent over 3.5 mill on a project rejected by CAISO. San Diego Gas and electric knows exactly what EVMWD is up to. I will print the letter for all to read when I have time. EVMWD uses LEAPS as an excuse to steal. The little shit Greg Morrison EVMWDS PR person calls the californian and the press Enterprise and lies to them so they will print in the news paper something about LEAPS it dosent matter what they just want it in the paper so they can justify stealing. Greg Morrison threatened to sue Chris Hyland when she tried to investigate his credit cards thats public information folks. Morrison and Young are constantly traveling to D.C. all expenses paid with rate payers dollars. Morrisons latest lie Morgan Stanley is backing the LEAPS project what a joke but if Morrison can find a pin head news reporter that dosent know the facts to listen to him he will try to get LEAPS in the paper you see if LEAPS looks legitimate its an excuse to steal steal and steal. The big story is EVMWD has spent over 3.5 mill on nothing and is making best best and krieger rich what is EVMWD board members getting out of this travel paid meetings and more than we know. When a law firm is paid 180 thousand dollars in one month theres something rotten in Denmark. Phil wicke ryan Anderson morrison young and John Brown are about as dirty as they come and it takes time to get the truth out but it will come out. Hopefully LLoyd will help but he has a reputation as a coward and a fool so it will take time when there is no one on the inside to help things can take three to four times longer but good things come to those who wait.

Anonymous said...

I read in the paper EVMWD is using an independent to do an enviormental impact statement I guess they want the world to know their going to pay someone off to lie. Nothing new they used a mechanical engineer to attempt to change the facts given by FERC. Dr. Pinnow exposed the truth. The city of Lake Elsinore is lucky to have Dr. Pinnow. This independent lie oh excuse me study will cost the rate payers thousands. The waste by this board is disgraceful. They dont really care if LEAPS comes or goes either way its an excuse to continue to spend rate payers money as if it were their own. Morrison looked like the fool he is in the paper today. His statement ended with Morgan Stanley is not sure how much money they will invest. What a stupid little man. How dumb does he think people are. I admit Elsinore was asleep at one time but were awake now you fools keep it up because I would like to see you all locked up in a small cell where you all belong, With several years to think about what you've done. This lie by EVMWD was in the paper a month ago shit head morris found out there was a new reporter at Press Enterprise and he thought it a good oppertunity to tell the same old lie that was in the californian a month ago. What he didn't expect is to run in to a smart reporter that tells both sides of the story Mr. Horseman I believe the reporters name was did an excellent side of finding out the facts by talking with CAISO and even our mayor. I know one thing about Bob Magee and that is he will not allow anyone to steal or waste money. He must be appauled by EVMWD. God love him for his comment at the end of the article because he is so right what we will be left with is a huge mud puddle and LEAPS wil cost millions to take down when it fails and it will fail because it will lose 150 million dollars per year. And thank you to the reporte at the pressenterprise I hope he continues to show an intrest in Lake Elsinore because there is a tremendous amount of important things going on in our rapidly growing city.

Anonymous said...

Yes - looks like we got a reporter that tells both sides.

Maybe he can reveal who hacked into the election returns that will show Chris Hyland was the one that really won the election and not Gugliepiggy. Could it be wtf or Phil Williams, Phil Paule, Greg Morrison or California Taxpayers Protection Committee???? There are ways to find out and I would not be surprised if it is being looked into.

Anonymous said...

Riverside county is extremely corrupt and that is why they want to continue with the electronic voting machines. With Dumbmoore in charge they probably didn't even need to hack into the system. Officials made sure to put DunnMoore in charge because they knew it would be extremely easy to confuse her and boy oh boy did they. People should ask themselves why was a woman appointed to this high level position that had absolutely no experience in it. With guidance from someone she screwed things up probably not even knowing she's doing it wrong, having had no experience and eager to please those who hired her and gave her this great job, she did exactly as she was mis lead to do. Find out who she went to for help and that would lead to some answers. IT IS SO OBVIOUS TO ME. SOMEONE WITH YEARS OF EXPERIENCE SHOULD HAVE BEEN GIVEN THAT POSITION HOW ABSURD TO GIVE A WOMAN LIKE DUNNMOORE A POSITION OF SUCH GREAT IMPORTANCE AND RESPONSIBILITY WHITH SUCH IMPORTANT END RESULTS. THIS WAS NOT CARELESSNESS IT WAS PLANNED AND IT WORKED. WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND. THINK ABOUT IT ITS OBVIOUS. NOW A CHANG OF SUBJECT; GROVER TRASK WAS PROBABLY ASTONISHED AT HOW MUCH MONEY BEST BEST AND KRIEGER WERE RECEIVING FROM EVMWD, SO HE FOLLOWED THE MONEY. HE NOW WORKS WITH BEST BEST AND KRIEGER IN THE DEPARTMENT OF CONFLICT OF INTREST PROBABLY MAKING MORE MONEY THAN HE DID AS D.A. NOW WE HAVE THIS BIG BAG OF HOT AIR PACHECO IN TRASKS PLACE, CAREFULLY PLACED THEIR BY TRASK. SOME SAY HES GREAT, HES TOUGH ,BE VERY WEARY OF THOSE WHO SAY THIS BECAUSE THEY KNOW OF CORRUPTION THAT OTHERS DONT. THE CORRUPTION IS EVERYWHERE ITS OUT OF CONTROL BECAUSE THOSE LIKE TRASK DONT CARE ABOUT WHITE COLLAR CRIME NOW WHY WOULD THAT BE USE YOUR HEAD THINK ABOUT IT. HOW ARROGANT AND POWERFUL THEY MUST THINK THEY ARE. THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE BESIDES THEM THAT HAVE TO LISTEN AND EVMWD HAS WASTED MILLIONS THAT FACT CANT BE IGNORED. LAWYERS LIKE JOHN BROWN WHOS BUSY GETTING HIS SHARE DESERVE TO LOSE THEIR LAW LICENSE. IT ALL BOILS DOWN TO GREED AND PATHETIC STUPID PEOPLE WITH NO MORALS OR IDEA WHY THEIR EVEN IN THIS WORLD. A BUNCH OF LOST GREEDY FOOLS THAT USE AND ABUSE ANYONE THAT STANDS IN THEIR PATH. CHRIS HYLAND WAS IN THEIR PATH BUT DONT WORRY CHRIS WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND. EVMWD IS USING RATE PAYER MONEY AND THEIR OWN LAWYERS PAID FOR BY RATE PAYERS TO PAY A PRIVATE ENTITY NEVADA HYDRO A THREE MAN CORRUPT SO CALLED COS. LEGAL BILLS. THATS RIGHT FOLKS EVMWD IS USING RATE PAYERS MONEY AND THE WATER BOARDS USING THEIR OWN LAWYERS FOR THIS PRIVATE CO AND EVMWDS IS PAYING THIS PRIVATE COMPANIES LEGAL BILLS WITH RATE PAYERS MONEY. LLOYD MR REFORMER KNOWS THIS HE JUST WATCHES SITS THERE QUIETLY. THEY JUST RAISED OUR RATES SO THEY CAN CONTINUE THIS ILEGAL UNETHICAL PRACTICE. ITS NOT JUST A CONFLICT OF INTREST ITS AGAINST THE LAW. TRASK WORKS IN THE DEPARTMENT OF CONFLICT OF INTRESTAT BEST BEST AND KRIGER A COINCIDENCE I DONT THINK SO PEOPLE PLEASE THINK PUT 1 AND 1 TOGETHER ITS OBVIOUS OBVIOUS OBVIOUS EVERYONE OF THESE LOST FOOLS IS LOOKING OUT FOR THEMSELVES AND THEIR FRIENDS LOOKING FOR LOOP HOLES TO STAY OUT OF TROUBLE SOONER OR LATTER THEY WILL BE EXPOSED INCLUDING YOU GROVER GOOD OL BOY TO ME YOUR A HOUND AND NOTHING MORE SNIFFING ALL THE DIRTY HOLES. SOMEONE BIGGER THAN YOU KNOWS WHAT YOUR UP TO, YOU CANT HIDE FROM HIM HE SEES EVERYTHING.

Anonymous said...

Those who read this and dont know whats going on let me clue you in. Best Best and Krieger is the law firm that works for EVMWD. EVMWD have no legal rights to use Best Best and Krieger to pay Nevada Hydros bills. Nevada Hydro are the three corrupt men that call themselves a company pushing the LEAPS project and getting hundreds of thousands of dollars now in the millions from EVMWD. This board knows they wont be paid back by Nevada Hydro and in fact Nevada Hydro has it in writing money will not be paid back if LEAPS is not built. Ofcourse LEAPS will never be built its the most assininge stupid project. A dam in a high risk fault zone would kill millions it will never happen but EVMWD wants the public to think it will and its legitimate so they can continue to funnel rate payers money to themselves and the rest of the gang the parties on but it will come to a crashing halt.

Anonymous said...

cost of water up
taxes on new homes increased
value of your home down the most
in Riverside county

Anonymous said...

Water is up because EVMWD is pouring our ratepayer money into Nevada Hydro and the LEAPS project. OOPS will the crooks get caught --YES.

Anonymous said...

EVMWD Mexico Trip!

i was shocked to find this video from last year of 2 EVMWD Board of Directors dancing it up in mexico while we the rate payers pick up the tab!

http://www.jibjab.com/starring_you/receipt/238715

Anonymous said...

Isn't that the peresident of Morgan Stanley with them?

Anonymous said...

god that mexico trip video is funny as hell.

Anonymous said...

one word sums it up EVMWD is lying. They think they can get away with paying bills for a private company with rate payer money. They have been getting away with it for years but they've been very very careless. Using rate payers money to pay for a private companies legal bills is not ok. This is a good job for EVMWD's super hero the one and only GROVER TRASK. Mr Trashk works for EVMWD's very own law firm BEST BEST AND KRIEGER IN THE DEPARTMENT OF CONFLICT OF INTREST. HEY GROVER YOU THINK THEIRS A CONFLICT OF INTREST HERE? YES THIS RICH AND FAMOUS MIGHTY FIRM COLLECTS ALOT OF FEES FROM EVMWD .THE PROBLEM IS RATE PAYER MONEY THAT SHOULD BE USED TOWARD WATER QUALITY IMPROVEMENTS AND NEW PIPES HAS AND IS GOING TOWARD PAYING NEVADA HYDROS LEGAL BILLS AND ALL OF THE REPORTS LAWYERS MUST BE INVOLVED IN TO ATTEMPT TO PUSH THIS DANGEROUS LEAPS PROJECT FORWARD. WASTING RATE PAYER MONEY IN THIS WAY IS A CRIME. USING RATE PAYER MONEY TO COME UP WITH DOCUMENTS THAT ATTEMPT TO CHANGE OR MISTRUE THE FACTS IS A CRIME. LEAVING 3.5 MILLION DOLLARS OUT OF THE BUDGET MONEY THAT RATE PAYERS HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW ABOUT IS A CRIME. TRAVELING DINING USING CREDIT CARDS TO TRAVEL IN THE NAME OF LEAPS WHICH CANT EVEN BE CONSIDERED A PROJECT IS A CRIME. RATE PAYERS ARE FOOTING THE BILLS FOR ALL OF THIS WASTE. RAISING WATER RATES IS EXPECTED BUT 20 DOLLARS THE HIGHEST RATE INCREASE IN THE HISTORY OF RIVERSIDE COUNTY IS A CRIME WHEN WASTE OF RATE PAYERS MONEY IS IN PROGRESS. EVMWD LIES SO MUCH I CANT KEEP TRACK OF ALL THEIR LIES. STATING IN A COMMERCIAL LAKE WATER QUALITY WILL BE IMPROVED IF LEAPS IS BUILT AS IF THAT WERE A FACT IS DISHONEST. THERE IS A CHANCE IT WILL MAKE WATER QUALITY WORSE, AND THEIR IS NO AGREEMENT THAT NEVADA HYDRO WILL PAY FOR WATER TO KEEP THE LAKE WATER LEVELS UP. THERE MAY NOT BE WATER AVAILABLE EVEN IF SOMEONE AGREED TO PAY FOR IT. THE SCIENTIFIC STUDIES TO PROVE LEAPS WOULD IMPROVE WATER QUALITY HAVE NOT BEEN DONE. A UCR PERSON WROTE UP A REPORT BASED ON SCIENTIFIC ASSUMPTIONS WHICH HE DID ADMIT WERE ASSUMPTIONS. EVMWDS COMMERCIAL STATED IT WOULD IMPROVE WATER QUALITY. THEY MIS LEAD LIE TELL HALF TRUTHS AND SPEND RATE PAYERS MONEY AS IF IT WERE THEIR OWN. WHO REPRESENTS THE RATE PAYERS LOOKS OUT FOR THEIR INTRESTS AND PROTECTS THE MONEY AS THEY WERE SWORN TO DO. JOHN BROWN EVMWDS ATTORNEY IS SUPPOSED TO BE FAIR TO ALL WITH HIS ADVICE TO EVMWD BOARD MEMBERS AND THE PUBLIC SUPPORTING EVMWDS WASTEFUL UNETHICAL ACTIONS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE HE WORKS FOR RATE PAYERS WE PAY HIS SALARY. EVMWD WORKS FOR US EACH AND EVERY RATE PAYER THEY HAVE FORGOTTEN THIS AND SPEND AND WAST OUR MONEY. EVMWDS ATTORNEY LIKES TO TELL EVERYONE FORMER DA TRASK WORKS WITH HIS FIRM NOW. SO WHAT LOOK AT THE STATE RIVERSIDE COUNTY IS IN. WE ARE ONE OF THE MOST CORRUPT AROUND. KEEP BRAGGING JOHN KEEP FEELING SAFE ALL OF YOU ARE FOOLISH. TALK ABOUT SHEEP IN WOLVES CLOTHING. DONT THINK WE THE PUBLIC DONT SEE THE TRUTH.

Anonymous said...

To the City Council on your
Civic Center
SELL! SELL! SELL!

Anonymous said...

Good Fuckley (Buckley) spending our tax dollars

Anonymous said...

Have you heard Phil Williams is no longer with the realtor Century 21 he is now a Consultant to Nevada Hydro to promote the LEAPS project.

Kris Anderson is taking on being Director of Finance for Nevada Hyrdo LEAPS project.......there goes our rate payer money.

That is not new we knew that would happen especially when they continued to push the project and served on the AD HOC committee for 6 years and never revealed what they talked about or approved with Nevada Hydro.

Anonymous said...

phil and anderson are working for Nevada Hydro because their stealing money. They all have to stick together. Its going to be enjoyable to listen to their explanations as to where the money went. I have a word of advice to the skinny anorexic woman or EVMWD's financial director. Perhaps the fact your not eating well is clouding your judgement. Eat up and start thinking clearly because if you have not accounted for every penny spent on Leaps you should do so pronto. If your stupid enough to take the word of Ronald Young ,Kris Anderson ,Phil Williams or Ben Wicke you had better wise up. You may like your job but without a license you will have no job .so if youve neglected some figures or ommited money you had better speak up numbers dont lie and yours dont add up. If your stupid enough to allow scum to steal and not follow government auditing standards it will be a joy to watch you go down.

Anonymous said...

If williams and anderson are working for nevada hydro the water board is paying their salary. Rate payer money is being funneled all over the place. I doubt this is true williams is on the water board he cant work for Nevada Hydro if he is he's in trouble.

Anonymous said...

Phil Williams, Ben Wicke, Havey the Country Club Heights mastermind and Gugliepig just got what they wanted the questionable 3 to take over the little Water District. Well you can bet Kris Anderson will cook the books.

You all know Jeff George and Phil Williams went to school together what does that tell you.....and George Bloomfield wants to buy his way into business deals with the EVMWD like he has with the City of Lake Elsinore.

Anonymous said...

To those who are honest and watching dont be discouraged this all takes time sometimes years but the outcome will be criminal. Stay patient and enjoy the parade of inbreeds led by baby boy brown who feels protected by big boy trashk and now trashk senior pacheco the newest inbreed. Its a circus that even the strongest guts are sickened by. Puke if you have to but stay tough its worth the wait.

Anonymous said...

Now there is some real intellect, you really show what you are made of with talk like that. I’ll bet its good old Pete Weber spewing his venom and writing that junk. I mean after all can we believe a lettuce packer. Here is guy that beats his wife and smacks his kids so much, they have to call the police for protection. If anyone doubts me, just ask Chris Hyland. She says she has the 911 tapes to prove it. She has been telling that story all over town. I hear that is why he has his nose so far up her butt, so she won’t expose him for what he is. Don’t worry “ol-Peteee” she will stab you in the back just like she has all of her other friends. She is a mean, ugly, ugly, ugly person. The two of you deserve each other, “IN MY OPINION”

Anonymous said...

why because Chris Hyland has exposed those unethical people on the Water Board? People like Greg Morrison who goes around and tells reporters at the Californian not to listen to Chris Hyland and then goes to the Editor of the paper and gets him against her when for years she has been feeding reporters more info than they can get their hands on ----- wait I understand the big one is coming. Or when Greg Morrison gets info from a Deputy District Attorney about what Chris Hyland reports them. The comments on No. 21 are from Phil Williams as he was the editor of all those dirty flyers that was put out about Chris Hyland. Further more you say those nasty comments about Peter Weber because he exposed the City in many unethical practices and next is EVMWD and we will laugh when the headlines come out with you Williams being exposed and totally the biggest liar of them all is that why you left Century 21 so when your exposed you won't hurt their business? Gee I would like to know the names of those friends could it be Phil Williams, Ben Wicke, Kris Anderson and Harvey Ryan the unethical team? What's matter Williams can't you stand it because she has so many documents to expose you with ----- remember the big one is coming. Chris HYland is always right because she probably does have those so-called tapes that will expose Greg MOrrison, Phil Williams. She also only stabs crooks in the back and right now it might not be long before those backs are bleeding.

Anonymous said...

Phil Williams looks you in the eye when he speaks, but his manner is one of domination. It's too bad that the board members don't recognize this, then maybe they would think for themselves when they speak with him and make up their own mind. It goes to training and education, the EVMWD board has none, Aristotelean Virtue theory is based on three virtues,1) Virtue courage: the courage to resist pressures from person in authoriy to do the right thing to furfill their responsibilities to the public, 2) Virtue expertise; having both technical and ethical expertise to understand and make appropriate professional judgements, 3)Virtue integrity; having the ability to inform the public of what is going on because it is right.
Unfortunately no one on the board has any of the charistiics for virtue that Aristotle wanted all in public service to aspire to, intead we have a board who waits for scraps to be thrown to them in the form of bogus trip to Washington DC and other places, but the lions share goes to the ringmasters, Best Best and Kreiger, Nevada Hydro, and one board member, who take cold hard cash for their endeavors. We know BBK understands Aristotle's virtues, but they warped them for thier own gain, NH is simply a 2 persons with no degrees of education in anything, simply scamming for dollars, and Phil, he is simply a person who invades your space when you speak with him, in doing so maniulates others who are of little self confidence to see things his way.
The losers in this are the rate payers, given high water bills and contamintaed water, but someday it will end, either at the ballot box, in the courts, or much more quickly if the other board members decide to have one of the virtues Aristotle speaks of. One of those virtues is enough and yet not one board member has it, if they did then Phil's scam would be finished. How disappointing that we couldn't get one voice from the board to speak for the people, to aspire to the virtues of Aristotle written over 2 thousand years ago that still hold true today.

Anonymous said...

A lettuce packer who goes with a fudege packer on the city council is going to do anything. I go to church and follow Christian doctrine as do the water board, we are doing the best we can for the community.

Anonymous said...

Phil Williams lets face it you are a crook and you will be exposed along with the other one Ben Wicke. Yes, as she says she has the documents. It is a shame that Best Best & Krieger hired Gover Trask because it will take a different law enforcment agency to put these people in jail. Grover is probably already telling Pacheco you can't find anything wrong with the directors at EVMWD -0-- what a joke he is.

Anonymous said...

Put Up or Shut Up
(Big chance of that happening! )

Anonymous said...

John Brown of Best Best and Kriger plays a game with EVMWD. He pretends their intelligent business persons making very important decisions. In the mean time he cleans up the mess they continually make and he knows better than anyone it will be a very very expensive mess that will continue to pay his firm a fortune. These board members are prostituted by their own attorney. You must feel so intelligent Mr. Brown. Its much easier and profitable not to give these fools any sound advice is it not Mr. Brown? Mr. Brown the attorney that over sees this mess and watches millions of rate payer dollars go straight to his firm should be ashamed to show his face. Guess what Mr. Brown your not that smart, and I know you know why just like we all do. You work for and advise stupid greedy fools that have dollar signs in their eyes of future jobs and all kind of grandiose ideas implanted in their heads by you and your Washington DC. friends.

Anonymous said...

Ronald Young EVMWD'S manager travels so much he is not overseeing the waste and abuse of power demonstrated by this board. But you see he is a part of the waste and abuse of rate payer money and he is enjoying it abundantly. Mr. Young likes his job. He travels year round his favorite destination DC, however there are many other trips he enjoys. With this amount of traveling there is no way Mr. Young would have time to manage EVMWD. Im sure Mr Young is greeted with a welcoming hand shake at the airport by different business men that are willing to take advantage of him. Men that are smarter and very willing to manipulate him. Remember Mr. Young and EVMWD have dolled out over 3.5 million dollars to various business men that know he is willing to spend rate payer money as if it were his own, and dont be naive there are people out there that prey on people like Mr. Young. The water board has access to alot of money they know this. An example Mr. Powdrowski a Washington DC lawyer that specializes in the law governing our states electricity needs. This is also the third member of the Nevada Hydro co. He is the brains behind the scheme. Mr. Young and EVMWD board members have been woooooed by this man because their is no nice way to put it THEIR DUMB. They believe people like Mr. Powdroski and Issa will pull strings for them and push the LEAPS project through so they will have access to huge sums of money. Mr. Powdrowski has made a fortune off of EVMWD. I've seen his billing 4000 dollars for a few days of travel expenses. You see when your an important person or business tycoon like Mr. Young and Powdroski you dont stay at Quality Inn oh no no no, always the Marriott or the Radisson $450 dollars a night for the suite room .I have the bill. Only five star Resorts will do for Mr. Young and his business partners. Put up or shut up I agree but the put up takes time and mean while rate payers should have some understanding of what is going on with rate payer money. I wish so much that others would get angry show up to meetings and voice their opinions. Many people would like to know why EVMWD gets away with calling LEAPS a project. It cant be classified as a project because the scientific and geological studies have not been done. The dam for the LEAPS project must go in a high risk fault zone and special geological studies must be done to allow this. None have been done, yet EVMWD has spent 3.5 mill on LEAPS. A CEQA report has not been done. Experts like CAISO have stated LEAPS cannot be classified as advanced its just a power station yet EVMWD continues to call it LEAPS instead of LEPS. This is one of many examples of how to deceive people with words calling it something it isn't so they can receive dollars. Whether EVMWD wants to admit it or not who cares. I've spoken with experts WHOM AGREE this is fraud waste and abuse of public funds. The fact that LEAPS cant be classified as advanced stops the whole project from ever going forward. This and much other neglected due diligence should have been done before spending one penny on LEPS. Irresponsible waste of rate payer money so a few can have a good time and feel like a tycoon.

Anonymous said...

The person calling Mr . Weber a fudge that will do anything is most likely Bob Shiffner. Genie Kelly and Shiffner will never forgive the treasurer for exposing their greed and stupidity. He demonstrated to them by showing facts and figures just how dumb and used they actually were for many years. The city attorney Leibold was also exposed. This blow to their sense of identity really hurt them. I think they were greedy but really had no idea the extent of damage their leadership was causing the city. Life is better now because Buckley Magee and Hickman understand what happened. We need honest city government and the reform has proven my point. It trickles down and even honest people get caught up in the results of poor leadership. Mr Brady may be doing a good job under our Mayor Magees leadership however he even at one time was caught up in not following the rules when helping his girlfriend obtain money for school. He did not follow policy just like the rest of the gang. The person calling Mr. Buckley a fudgee hates him because he couldn't pull him into dishonest unethical behaviour and he went along with the treasurer . Mr Weber unfortunately does not at this time have many friends alot dont like his tacticts which do leave little to be desired at times but, Buckley is a sincere friend of the treasurer so dont believe what is written about him any friend of the treasurer is hated and abused. We can only hope Mr. Buckley will be Mayor rumor has it Magee would like a break one cant blame him its constant turmoil and work if you take public office seriously and truly attempt reform, but we can hope he will continue Mayorship because Genie Kelly was remember forced into reform and should not under any circumstances sit in that seat. That seat is meant for one with honor and integrity and some skills in business. Genie made sure Barbara Leibold made almost 1, million dollars in one year along with Shiffner and that horrible female mayor her name slips my mind. Several deaths occured under her watch including children. Do you want her as mayor? I think its to risky Bob needs to keep the seat because she will screw up some of his hard work.

Anonymous said...

Put up or shut up what? Grammer school mentality for sure, must be a water board person, oh excuse me, director. Fact is no one on the water board ever directed much of anything, oh wait a minute, they have directed my money straight to Nevada Hydro, other than that nothing of significence except their poop all over the floor.

Anonymous said...

Has anybody smelled the water from the tap lately, very, very chlorineted, or should I say Chlroimated, albiet Chlorate, chlorine, chloride, is there a difference. The directors don't think so, but there is, chemistry 101, first semester, but since the ringleader the honorable Director Williams never got past high school I would never expect him to know such simple chemistry, hell solphmore high school even teaches the subject. Phil attendence at seminars on chemistry on the very subject in Washington D.C., Montreal, Paris haven't helped much, I guess he was too involved with another Director with eyes of a very ugly pug; yuk...talk about beastiality, come on Phil. After all you can only teach a brick wall so much, just ask his dad who sued the city for $2 million and won't give a nickel to his own son, last I heard the city may get all of it to build the new downtown city hall. How about your friend on the board who looks like you, hair wise, the one who's gal is hangs all over him to ensure his security,, talk about a director in need of external influence, it's no wonder he has you replace her in closed session meetings. He longs to be physically loved and adorned,she can't be there in closed session so Phil fills that void, and then she wraps her arms around him when you get out of the meeting. She is so dedicated to him, in a biziarre way, personnaly I don't believe her act espeicially when she places her arms around him all night at meetings at the Diamond and as she looks over the directors shoulder and eyes the crowd to se who is looking. He is so in need he refuses to acknowledge what she is doing even though it is so obvious he does know. Talk about high school, how solphmoric. You both need help, the director physically groping her while she stares at all around her for attention for some sort of power trip or sexual turn on is sick. To the girlfriend, don't overcomphenate in public for his shortcomings. He neeeds to look to the great pihilophers for gudence and direction.Did he have diretcion in his life before Phil? Probalby not, he probably wouldn't be in the very simplistic and maniputable state he is in. Don't look to Phil, he sees this and preys upon it, using your directors perception of himself for his own gain. Look to Aristotle, look to some religiuos preachings, don't look to Phil, he can only disappoint you and eventually abandon you. You will be left alone, torn asunder by the desires of a complete fraud. Who should this other director place his trust in? Someone please help him!!!

Anonymous said...

Lets add a litte Greg Morrison to the above lists. This man is going to be exposed and he going to get his ass kicked of EVMWD by his unethical practices and law enforcement will see to that because he thinks he smart but he ain't. So lets go after him.

Anonymous said...

Mr. Morrison is mr. youngs little travel partner his little gopher his little butler, but he overlooks this fact instead he thinks he's with a very important washington DC executive and he's there by his side to aide him on their very important business at hand.What a joke all their doing is ripping off rate payers. The little shit threatened to sue Chris Hyland for requesting his credit card statements. he's ashamed of what a greedy little shit he is. Anyone that would like to see them under the freedom of information act may request them and they by law have to give them to you or their in big trouble.Its peaked my curiosity I want to see them we all should request them both young and morris.

Anonymous said...

Chris Hyland- has them for 2005 and 2006 I saw them. One of the most interesting ones that I was fortuante to see was where he was purchasing medicine. We the ratepayer is paying for his medicine??????

Anonymous said...

The city did the same thing. Watenpaugh used to shop at savon and pick up perscriptions from the pharmacy he would buy shaving supplies soap and leave with 50 dollars spent on the city credit card. He once went to Vincenzos twice in one day probably stoped by there on his way home to get dinner for his wife and himself. The water board are the remaining Elsinore trash their probably worse than the city used to be because they have more money. We need reform the city changed but these stragglers are the old trash that helped ruin Lake Elsinores reputation over the years and they want to continue stealing. You see in their world they think their entitled to take and waste and enjoy what they were sworn to protect. The old Lake Elsinorians uneducated white trash used by the educated but happy to get the scraps to dumb to know how dumb they are or that their getting scraps hell I guess they dont care they know scraps are the best they will get and their proud to have them and take pride in being around those who throw them their way and aknowledge their existence.

Anonymous said...

Don't worry about the City. Just worry about all the money that certain Board of Directors are spending on themselves as well as Ron Young and Greg Morrison.And for that matter all the money spent on continual Conferences that the employees spend in travel. And all the millions being spent on travel to Washington D. C. by Ben Wicke, and Now Harvey Ryan - oh, yes were told he has an in in Washington, D.C. that is why he is making these trips Ha!Ha! Gugliepig was not even in office for a month until she was off to Washington, D.C. why she doesn't know her ass from a hole in the ground about the workings of the Water District. I understand that Chris Hyland was never asked to go to Washington, D.C. in all the years she was on the the Board. Why because they disrespected her because she exposed them for the illegalities they conspire in and asking for documents that would expose their unethical ways. In other words they are they most unprofessional people that represent the ratepayers.

Don't worry crooks are always caught and it will happen just takes a little time with law enforcement.

Anonymous said...

Its a sad day when Grover Trask is proud to go to work for BEST BEST AND KRIEGER. Why you ask? If the rate payers knew how much of their rate payer dollars have gone to this firm secondary to a gullable uneducated board and corrupt staff they would be beside themselves. This is why they get away with it no one can stomach this reality. However there are some that will ride out the storm and in fact feel they were destined to expose corruption which is so rampant everywhere. Word has it Weber is busy , you see he is half way through school and is getting his Masters degree in the science of auditing so he can infact devote his remaining lifes work to exactly this cause. Its actually good that you say he beats his wife and kids because maybe if you make him angry enough he will pull his head out of his books and complete his report to be turned in to I'll never tell you see it wont be rushed when he turns it in it will be perfect and accurate. What is said about him is a lie which will never be backed up with evidence so go ahead try and make him angry the angrier the better.Over the years Mr. Trask was given reports on corruption nothing was ever done.

Anonymous said...

Grover Trask is totally unethical. The comments made about him in the past because no matter how many times the citizens of Lake Elsinore have gone to the Grand Jury with illegal situations never would Grover Trask indict them.The comments for years regarding Trask was "If you were are politician and you blew someones brains out he would not indict you" and that is exactly what is going to happen now if anyone goes to the Grand Jury or the DA or........regarding EVMWD he will stop it that is his character. We thought Pacheco was going to be an honest politician but look he is following the Trask pattern because as he has stated Trask is his Mentor ugh!

Anonymous said...

Grover Trask is responsible for a disservice to Lake Elsinore residents over the years in my opinion. By ignoring white collar crime over the years it grew. What may not have seemed worth bothering with in his opinion has allowed the foolish leadership in lake Elsinore to have a sense of entitlement to take and abuse money that is not theirs to take. Corruption Having been reported many times over the years and no action being taken gave the city and the water board a sense of security to continue to push the limits. Now millions have been wasted with nothing to show for it. Gambling on a project like LEPS without doing the due diligence first is an example of complete security to waste public funds. Why would Grover Trask want to make EVMWD mad after all upon retirement he went to work for them, talk about a conflict of intrest Grover good ol boy. Grover specialty the Brown Act however he ignored the fact that for ten years EVMWD had ad hoc meetings about LEPS for ten years under ADHOC so they could keep the public out of meetings. Adhoc means temporary meetings or short term. It takes a strong stomach to ignore hypochrites but someone bigger than little ol us is watching just take comfort in that and press forward.

Anonymous said...

Grover Trask is responsible for a disservice to Lake Elsinore residents over the years in my opinion. By ignoring white collar crime over the years it grew. What may not have seemed worth bothering with in his opinion has allowed the foolish leadership in lake Elsinore to have a sense of entitlement to take and abuse money that is not theirs to take. Corruption Having been reported many times over the years and no action being taken gave the city and the water board a sense of security to continue to push the limits. Now millions have been wasted with nothing to show for it. Gambling on a project like LEPS without doing the due diligence first is an example of complete security to waste public funds. Why would Grover Trask want to make EVMWD mad after all upon retirement he went to work for them, talk about a conflict of intrest Grover good ol boy. Grover specialty the Brown Act however he ignored the fact that for ten years EVMWD had ad hoc meetings about LEPS for ten years under ADHOC so they could keep the public out of meetings. Adhoc means temporary meetings or short term. It takes a strong stomach to ignore hypochrites but someone bigger than little ol us is watching just take comfort in that and press forward.

Anonymous said...

Mr. Trashk has the perfect job. Imagine all the reports over the years turned into him regarding the corruption and unethical practices of the EVMWD board and staff. The ones he ignored. Surely he knows the board and staff are incompetent. Dont think for one minute Trashk dosen't know how much money EVMWD has paid Best BEST and Krieger the law firm EVMWD uses and now the law firm Mr. Trashk has chosen to work for. Mr. Trashsk will have more work then he can handle and he knows that fact. Over 30 years of reports regarding the unethical and probably ilegal activities by the city and EVMWD were ignored by Mr Trashsk. Now that his pockets will be lined he will offer his expertise on the law. Now thats a man of honor someone to be proud of. Is there ever an end to the scope of people that will use and abuse this board for their own gain. This board and staff keep digging the hole their falling in deeper and deeper. Unfortunately there are plenty of people like BBK and Grover that are willing to dig them out because it pays big time! EVMWD has access to alot of money and are glad to pay BBK and Grover as if it were their own. Here's some of Grover's areas of expertise; Development of ethics code and compliance, management anti fraud program and controls, independent management audits, liability protection strategies, provide training for management staff and elected officials. political reform act. and the public records act. And THE BROWN ACT. Situations involving violations in many of his areas of expertise were reported to him over the years and he did nothing. Now that his pockets will be lined he will offer his advice and expertise on ethics and the law.t Now thats a man to be proud of. One of true integrity and honor would uphold these laws and advise and warn those who dont, will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. One without these traits will help the wealthy and squirm around looking for a legal loop hole to help the dishonest and greedy get out of trouble. In otherwords find legal loop holes and walk that fine line which if challenged is usually against the law. Dont worry EVMWD board and staff ,your good friend Grover will be glad to help you out because he knows rate payers will most assuradely pay his salary and that is a guarenteed big payment. Mr. Williams will be called Mr. Williams sir by Mr. trask. Phil has no clue that those who use him will make him feel like an extremely intelligent business man because he thinks he is one. I disagree with the previous comment I dont think Phil is a manipulator I just think he's not a very bright person. Manipulating and fooling this board is like taking candy from a baby. Maybe EVMWD's hero Grover Trashk can help them out with the fact their using millions of dollars of rate payer money to pay nevada hydro's legal bills. Nevada Hydro is a private entity and EVMWD is using their lawyers BBK to defend these three crooks and paying all their legal fees with rate payer money. This is a deplorable atrocious betrayel of rate payers. Rate payers are against the LEPS scam yet our rate payer money pays Nevada Hydros legal bills against our wills. There is mounting evidence this money will never be paid back. Any reasonable person that saw the evidence would agree. Hey Grover do you see a conflict of intrest regarding this issue. Oh I forgot you want a 200,000 thousand dollar retainer fee before you'll answer me. What a man of honor and integrity. Now if I were phil I would pay you with rate payer money but im not, so I guess I wont get an answer . ohh well. You see working for EVMWD assures payment and big payment all with rate payer money spent as if it were their very own time and time again. Come on Grover you can come up with a loop hole show them how smart and clever you are. Make um proud Grover. I for one know you will. I have 30 years proof and your actions tell us alot. Im not naive many lawyers are out for the money, but you were the DA, you were supposed to be an example for the people, instead were ashamed of you.

Anonymous said...

What we need to do is put Phil Williams in jail. I wonder if Chris Hyland as any files on him. Knowing her she probably does.

This man has got something going for him in a position with Nevada Hydro ---- remember he just left Century 21 ----- I did realize his was so rich. When is father won a l.5 million from the city - he walked away from Phil Williams and his sister giving them no no no no money... HA!

Another who will have a position with Nevada Hydro will be Kris Anderson remember those two were the LEAPS AD HOC and it is rumored they never brought forth to the rest of Board went on in those secret meetings.

Anonymous said...

Vanhaster was caught because lawyers got involved. Now he gets to pick up trash on the freeway in an orange jump suit. His good friend Seyrato another crook stated his goal was always service to the community. Thats good because I see alot of garbage on the side of the freeway and his services will be appreciated. He was dishonest and greedy so his services to the community should involve trash pick and menial tasks nothing where he has authority or power. Lawyers need to get involved and expose the corruption at EVMWD. They would make a fortune and help the community end years of dishonest leadership and corruption.The whole board should be picking up dog shit instead their in positions of leadership where they continue to steal on a daily basis. Wasting money on the LEPS scam is the same as stealing. They hire the best auditors and brag about how our former DA works for the firm they use and in their arrogance they feel safe and protected. They make what Vanhaster did look mild in comparison to their corruption and waste of rate payer money. A smart lawyer sooner or later is going to file a suit that will kick their ass and expose them. In their case picking up shit is not fitting punishment they belong in jail and its just a matter of time.

Anonymous said...

I can hardlky wait till I see Ben Wicke and Phil Williams handcuffed. Wicke is almost as crooked as Williams. Ryan will follow and Anderson will get in the white and black strips too because she and Williams were the undercover agents for Nevada Hydro in closed secret meetings.

Anonymous said...

Kris Anderson and Phil Williams for ten years were paid to go to meetings regarding LEPS. These meetings were under the title of ADHOC. ADHOC is described under the official definition as temporary or short term.The only reason they used the term ADHOC is because they knew this was the only way to keep it off the agenda and keep the public out. So Phil and Kris Anderson met with lawyers and Nevada Hydro in secret for years. Perhaps the exact number of days that would define ADHOC is not stated however what reasonable person would consider 10 years temporary or short term. Ofcourse no one would including a DA or Grand jury. This information was given to Grover Trasks detectives, It was also brought forward to Rod Pacheco our current DA., and last but not least it was given to the Grand Jury this is all on record and can be proven. No wonder EVMWD is so out of control. No wonder they feel safe to waste rate payer money on a scam and travel all over the United States. You see those who are sworn to uphold the law are doing absolutely nothing to punish them forget punish them they dont even discourage them. They feel safe wasting money because they have gotten away with it for years. There is nothing confusing about this violation of the brown act. Why does our DA Rod Pacheco act like he's confused about this violation of the Brown act. He has arranged for the public to attend meetings to learn more about the Brown Act. He's the one playing dumb. Ten years can in no way mean temporary or short term to a reasonable person. Vanhaster was charged with conflict of intrest and violating the Brown act Regarding Vanhaster Our Da had to do something it was all to obvious and suits were filed. Thats what needs to happen in Elsinore. The reporter in the paper made the statement that those in public office should think twice before they attempt to do what Vanhaster did. OH YEAH ITS BEEN GOING ON FOR TEN YEARS IN ELSINORE CONFLICT OF INTREST, VIOLATION OF THE BROWN ACT, FRAUD WASTE AND ABUSE OF PUBLIC FUNDS JUST THOUGHT ID MENTION A FEW. WHOS THE LUCKY LAWYER GOING TO BE. GO AFTER THIS BOARD AND EXPOSE THEM. OUR DA AND GRAND JURY AND FORMER DA NEED TO ANSWER THE QUESTION, WHY HAVE THEY IGNORED AND ABANDONED THE PEOPLE THEY SHOULD BE PROTECTING. GOD MUST HAVE SOMEONE OUT THERE A GOOD LAWYER THAT WILL HELP US EXPOSE ALL THIS WASTE AND ABUSE. IT REALLY IS HARD TO BELIEVE JUST HOW FAR THIS BOARD IS WILLING TO PUSH THE LIMITS. THEY HAVE NO FEAR.

Anonymous said...

Rod Pacheco will never do anything. Grover Trask is his mentor. The reason Grover Trask is sitting in Best Best & Krieger's office is to make sure that the crooks at EVMWD don't go to jail and he knows he has Rod Pacheco in his palm. It is rumored an investigation in the Grand Jury is now stopped - gee I wonder who was the instigator to stop it, of course, Grover Trask. Was it because they have found out illegal situations at EVMWD that will prove what many of us who have been telling law enforcement for years of illegal situations are going on behind closed doors.

The FBI needs to step in. The only way that citizens could prove crooks were in Lake Elsinore City Hall - was I understand those involved was by filing Qui Tam lawsuits against Brinley and Molendyke which proved they were crooked and they had to pay back all the money they took. Now is the time to go after EVMWD and show the rate payers they are staging illegal use of our money to fill the pockets of Nevada Hydro which probably in the end will share with those Directors and Manager who are promoting and voting for the LEAPS project.

So is the time for Rod Pacheco to show he is an ethical District Attorney and prosecute. It would be interesting as to why the Grand Jury stopped their investigation. Does anyone have any information.

Anonymous said...

If a committee falls under ad hoc subquorum committee exemption government code section 54952(B)it exempts advisory committes that are comprised solely of less than a quorum of the members of the legislative body that created them. This exemption does not apply if the advisory committee is a standing committee. A standing committee is a committee that has continuing jurisdiction over a particular subject matter govt code 54952{b}. In EVMWD'S case the continuing subject matter LEAPS. Mr Williams and Mrs Anderson were paid to go to these meetings which means the board had to be aware and agree. This also means they must follow the law. They met with lawyers and Nevada Hydro to discuss LEAPS. It would not be subject to the BROWN ACT if they completed these meetings within a reasonable time perioud which can be a long perioud of time 6 months perhaps maybe longer but five years ten years absolutely not! ADHOC committes are formed to solve a problem or come up with new ideas, there not meant to last for years and years. Mr Williams and Mrs Anderson were in clear violation of the Brown Act. John Brown knows they were in violation of the Brown Act, and he should be reported to the barr for watching this take place for ten years. Mr. Brown Mrs Anderson and Mr. Williams all knew that under ADHOC government code dictates the public cannot attend. They also knew that under standing committee govt code states the public can attend and the meeting would have to be placed on the agenda. So they met secretly under ADHOC . There is no confusion here. Mr. Pacheco wrote a letter acting as if he were confused about the Brown Act. Trask and Pacheco are not confused about the Brown Act its very basic and easy to understand. Both these men are held to a higher standard they have to know the law. Am I supposed to believe they dont understand something as basic as the Brown Act? These violations were reported to Pacheco and the letter he wrote proves he is unclear about whether a violation was committed. This letter should be printed in the paper for all to read. The city should know both of these district attorneys ignored a violation in the brown act. Its pertinent because in these secret meetings LEAPS was discussed and 3.5 million rate payer dollars were wasted on this scam and we have nothing to show for it. EVMWD has made the firm Best Best and Krieger wealthy with rate payer money. The citizens of Elsinore cant trust a DA that dosen't understand the Brown Act. Apparently were supposed to believe Mr. Trask dosen't understand either because he also ignored this violation of the Brown Act. The paper should also be informed that EVMWD is using this firm to pay Nevada Hydros bills. conflict of intrest number one Grover Trask works for Best Best and Kriger the law firm EVMWD uses. Is that why he ignored their violations of the Brown Act. Conflict of intrest #2 rate payer money is paying crooks legal bills and evidence shows this money wont be paid back. #3 rate payer money should not be used to pay a private entitys legal bills. Waste and abuse of public funds is not acceptable. Due diligence must be prioritized. CAISO should have been consulted first not 3.5 million dollars later.Im supposed to believe Nevada Hydro and EVMWD didn't know they needed Caiso's involvement please how stupid do you think we are obviously you think we're in a coma. Just recently CAISO informed EVMWD cannot go through with LEAPS because it dosen't qualify as advanced so it should be called LEPS this does away with the whole project and proves what I already know LEPS is a way to abuse rate payer funds and it always has been. Its a way to take rate payer money and in doing so make a fortune for BEST BEST And KRIEGER. The billing shows one month they paid BBK 180,0000 thousand dollars. Rate payers have nothing to show for it and our DA Grover Trask is proud to work for BBK. Irresponsible waste and abuse of public funds. No DA will get their hands on any of the information that will be reported and it will be reported to those who understand this is fraud and abuse without a doubt. No one in riverside can be trusted and certainly no one in washington dc but their are those who can and will understand exactly what has taken place.

Anonymous said...

Honey I've got news for you EVMWD has done much worse things then violate the Brown Act, after seeing just a few examples I agree with one statement you made and that is they think we're in a coma. I would go as far as saying they were counting on us being in a coma . The pieces are fitting together like a puzzle and one of the easier puzzles i've had the joy of putting together. Why do you assume EVMWD's financial director is a CPA. A puzzle piece hire those not qualified. Her skills are those of someone who failed math. She is at the very least an accountant and a very poor one.

Anonymous said...

Did you see Gugliepigs article in EVMWD's WaterLog wasting our rate money on her lies. One thing she did not explain is how she had to close down the Spaghetti House Restuarant. She says she is committed to studying all of the issues facing the District so she can make decisions based on what is best for the community....she does not know her a-- from a hole in the ground watch her at meetings she is coached by Phil Williams and now she is crowned "I second the motion".

Anonymous said...

Its all so sick and pathetic. She stated she became a board member to assure fair rates and keep water rates down. She voted to raise them 20 dollars over two years. We cant report anything to our DA because he is in the corrupt palm of
Grover Trashk so its even hard to report corruption. Ofcourse when corruption is suspected with evidence to back it up there are other routes. But its all so sick and pathetic one dosen't know whether to puke or laugh at them.

Anonymous said...

Thought Id check the web site before turning in night owl that iam. I saw something hilarious on line. Dunmoore of the county registrar of voters stated she wanted Grover Trassssshk to do an investigation to prove there was no voter fraud. HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HEE HEE HEE HEEE HEE HEE HOO HOOO. NOW THAT I HAD A GOOD LAUGH GOODNIGHT TO ALL.

Anonymous said...

Lloyd how gullable are you? Defending this board shows how foolish you are. Every time the board does something behind your back your comment," I cant believe they did that" Are you in highschool these are not your friends you fool start believing it and do what you were elected to do .REFORM please look it up in the dictionary. You believe everything thats told to you because your to lazy or cowardly to do anything about it. Thats the problem or maybe your just gullable and dumb, one of those people that are eaisly convinced. Mr. Lloyd keep defending them because your lazy. Your a liar you have done no reform. Your defending the board while they make an ass out of you behind your back. Trust me they think your really gullable and easy to fool. You are. Your on the board and you've decided its your duty to defend the board the very opposite of what you promised the rate payers. If the board looks bad so do you Mr. Lloyd is that why your defending them so you can be lazy and look good. You've lied to the rate payers and sit there and continue to do nothing. Rationalize it all you want but your no good Mr. lloyd. Kiss John Browns ass and phil williams you little brown nose cowardly lazy kiss ass. Your worse than them. To bad Mr. Pinnow is not on the board atleast he has a brain you dont even have common sense. I CANT BELIEVE THEY DID THAT GET THE HELL OFF THE BOARD. YOUR FRIENDS TO THE END WE STICK TOGETHER WAKE UP MR LLOYD YOUR SO FOOLISH.